Session 27 - Daniel 1–4
Barry Forder
Barry Forder · Sunday 2 May 2021 · Daniel 2
The king is so disturbed that he calls for his royal advisors, he is evidently not bothered about how this will make him look, he just needs to know what this dream meant. Some of us have dreams - in fact I have heard it said that we all have dreams, it’s just that not all of us remember them! Many dreams are an amalgamation of thoughts and images that we have seen that day, or in recent days. Some dreams are simply because we had too much pepperoni on the pizza before we went to bed last night. But without doubt God uses dreams to communicate. As well as in the book of Daniel, there are many dreams recorded in the Bible such as those connected to Joseph in the book of Genesis (Josephs own dreams, the butler and baker in prison, Pharaoh’s dream). In Job we read:
“For God speaketh once, yea twice, yet man perceiveth it not. In a dream, in a vision of the night, when deep sleep falleth upon men, in slumberings upon the bed;” (Job 33:14-15)
In the book of Acts, Peter quoted from the prophet Joel who said: “And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams” (Acts 2:17)
In the usual (and no doubt wise) way you address the most powerful man in the known world, the Chaldeans get straight in there and ask the king to tell them the dream and they would be only too pleased to give the interpretation – no doubt their formula books at the ready.
There is some debate as to what Nebuchadnezzar is saying here; he is either saying that he can’t remember the dream, or that the ‘thing’ that has gone from him is the command to interpret the dream; it would seem more likely that it is the latter. J Vernon McGee states: This would be a rather extreme judgment, but you can see what the king wants. Frankly, a faulty translation of this verse gives the impression that the king had forgotten his dream. He hadn’t forgotten his dream. He knows the dream, senses its importance, and refuses to divulge it to the wise men. Why? He wants to get a correct interpretation of it. In the margin, the American Standard Version of 1901 translates “The thing is gone from me” as, “The word is gone forth from me.” In other words, Nebuchadnezzar is saying to these men, “I will not change my mind about this judgment I am pronouncing. Don’t beg me to tell you the dream—I’m not going to do it. You are going to come up with the dream if I am to listen to your interpretation of it.” The Berkeley Version has a helpful translation at this point also: “The king answered the Chaldeans, ‘This word I speak, I mean! If you do not tell me the dream and what it means, you shall be torn limb from limb and your houses will be destroyed.’” That translation really tones it down, but nevertheless the penalty is still excessive and extreme. Nebuchadnezzar is putting fear in these men. They have to come up with the interpretation of the dream, but they first of all have to give what the dream is.
This was a real problem for them. They could given an interpretation for dreams – if they had them! But without a dream to begin with, they were well and truly stuck. This reminds me of the humorous anecdote of the scientists who have become so clever they don’t need God. They explain to God that they can now create life. God asks them if they could do it like He did it – from the dust of the ground. They look at each other and confidently assert that they could even do this, after all, the essential ingredients that we are made of are found in the dust of the earth. God decides to take them up on this challenge, so says ‘Go ahead then. Create life from the dust of the ground’. So the scientists bend down and pick up a few handfuls of dust to head back to their laboratory. All of a sudden God interrupts them, “Oh no you don’t. Get your own dust!”
that can shew the king's matter: therefore there is no king, lord, nor ruler, that asked such things at any magician, or astrologer, or Chaldean.
11 And it is a rare thing that the king requireth, and there is none other that can shew it before the king, except the gods, whose dwelling is not with flesh.
It is interesting in scripture how often ‘evil’ men speak the truth. Here they are absolutely correct that only ‘the gods, whose dwelling is not with flesh’ can do what the king is asking. Caiaphas, the high priest made the following true statement about Jesus that was also prophetic: “Ye know nothing at all, Nor consider that it is expedient for us, that one man should die for the people, and that the whole nation perish not.” (John 11:49-50). Judas said: “I have betrayed the innocent blood.” (Matt 27:4).
Socrates said: ‘It maybe that God can forgive sin, but I don’t see how’. This shows great insight and understanding of the nature of God and the nature of man. God is righteous and holy and therefore cannot just forgive and forget sin. Sin – the inherent nature of man since the fall – has to be paid for, if justice is to be done. God would simply not be just if He ignored sin – this is what Socrates realised. The problem is, how can a finite man pay an infinite price? It cannot be done. But because “God so loved the world, He gave His only begotten Son that whosoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life”. So God, whose dwelling is not with flesh, became flesh and dwelt amongst us (John 1:14) so that He, being infinite, could pay the infinite price for sin that we owed, thus once and for all satisfying the justice of a holy God.
12 For this cause the king was angry and very furious, and commanded to destroy all the wise men of Babylon.
13 And the decree went forth that the wise men should be slain; and they sought Daniel and his fellows to be slain.
15 He answered and said to Arioch the king's captain, Why is the decree so hasty from the king? Then Arioch made the thing known to Daniel.
This is just great! Daniel gets home and says to his friends: “Guess what guys, the king has had a dream. No one could figure it out so he was going to kill all of us…..But I told him that me and my buddies would be able to work it out! How cool is that? You can hear their reply: ‘You did what?!’
It’s at times like these that we are so glad that our God is merciful. What did they pray that evening? We can only speculate but possibly Psalms like Psalm 28:1-2 “Unto thee will I cry, O LORD my rock; be not silent to me: lest, if thou be silent to me, I become like them that go down into the pit. Hear the voice of my supplications, when I cry unto thee, when I lift up my hands toward thy holy oracle.” Or maybe Psalm 31:1-4: “In thee, O LORD, do I put my trust; let me never be ashamed: deliver me in thy righteousness. Bow down thine ear to me; deliver me speedily: be thou my strong rock, for an house of defence to save me. For thou art my rock and my fortress; therefore for thy name's sake lead me, and guide me. Pull me out of the net that they have laid privily for me: for thou art my strength.”
21 And he changeth the times and the seasons: he removeth kings, and setteth up kings: he giveth wisdom unto the wise, and knowledge to them that know understanding:
22 He revealeth the deep and secret things: he knoweth what is in the darkness, and the light dwelleth with him.
23 I thank thee, and praise thee, O thou God of my fathers, who hast given me wisdom and might, and hast made known unto me now what we desired of thee: for thou hast now made known unto us the king's matter.
Arioch is typical of your bureaucratic professional type. Notice how he claims all the credit for solving the king’s problems!
26 The king answered and said to Daniel, whose name was Belteshazzar, Art thou able to make known unto me the dream which I have seen, and the interpretation thereof?
27 Daniel answered in the presence of the king, and said, The secret which the king hath demanded cannot the wise men, the astrologers, the magicians, the soothsayers, shew unto the king;
Daniel again makes it clear that it is not because he is more intelligent or better than anyone else that God has revealed the dream to him; but for 1) ‘their sakes that shall make known the interpretation’ i.e. Daniel and his three friends and 2) for the king himself that he would understand.
32 This image's head was of fine gold, his breast and his arms of silver, his belly and his thighs of brass,
33 His legs of iron, his feet part of iron and part of clay.
34 Thou sawest till that a stone was cut out without hands, which smote the image upon his feet that were of iron and clay, and brake them to pieces.
power, and strength, and glory.
38 And wheresoever the children of men dwell, the beasts of the field and the fowls of the heaven hath he given into thine hand, and hath made thee ruler over them all. Thou art this head of gold.
Now we move onto the ‘iron’ nation that breaks into pieces and subdues all things. Even those with a basic grasp of history will be familiar with the empire that succeeded the Greeks. Rome. Whereas the previous empires took the best of the cultures and nations they were conquering, leaving much intact, Rome did not. The Roman Empire seemed to thrive on what it could destroy. It really did break into pieces and subdue all things
It is easy to just read over this verse and continue with the interpretation; however, if we read carefully there is a strange remark. We are told that, just as iron was mixed with miry clay in the vision, they shall mingle themselves with the seed of men. Who are the ‘they’? From the context, and the fact that they mix themselves with the seed of men, would seem to exclude them from being the seed of men themselves. Chuck Missler (among others) see this as an allusion to the Nephilim (offspring of fallen angels). The first mention of these beings is in Genesis 6, the flood came to wipe them out, but we read that more came after the flood (Gen 6:4) only to be finished off by Joshua and then finally by David (remember Goliath & his brothers?). However Jesus said: “as it was in the days of Noah, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man” (Luke 17:26) Could it be that the Nephilim are set to make a return as part of a major end times delusion? (For more on this subject see ‘Alien Encounters’ by Dr Chuck Missler & Dr Mark Eastman).
There are those who would try to suggest that all prophecy has been fulfilled, and that Christ’s kingdom was established at His first coming in and through the church. Furthermore it is proposed that the church is now to fill the earth and subdue it in the name of Christ. Although not so prevalent in the UK, names such as ‘Kingdom Now’ and ‘Dominion Theology’ are well known in America of groups that support this idea. However have seen The Emerging Church, Mission Shaped Church, Messy Church and many others that have taken hold in this country. One of the underlying themes of these initiatives is a non-literal interpretation of scripture, particularly in regard to prophecy. The emphasis is on getting people into the church (nothing wrong with that on the surface) but at the expense of watering down the word of God so as not to be ‘offensive’ (and there we have the real problem – to present a sinner with a gospel that says he is a sinner on his way to hell unless he repents and puts his trust in Jesus, is always going to be offensive until such a person is brought under conviction by the law - see Psalm 19:7 / Rom 7:7 / Gal 3:24). By watering down the gospel message and not presenting the law, the modern church becomes nothing more than a caring social club; but without the solid foundation of God’s word they will yield to popular opinion and political pressure every time.
All of this goes hand in hand with a belief known as ‘Preterism’ which, in its extreme form holds that all prophecies have been fulfilled (by 70AD) and that Jesus is not really coming back physically but is now reigning in the hearts of Christians.
As even a casual reading of this chapter (and these last few verses in particular) will show, this simply cannot be, because the church is not a political kingdom, whereas the kingdom that God establishes here is a political rule on the earth that puts an end to mans government once and for all. The fact that the church exists alongside political ‘kingdoms’ in the world today shows that the church is not the stone cut without hands, for once that stone smites the feet of the image, it all comes crumbling down and there will be no more opposition. The fact that the church has opposition in this order of things shows that it cannot be the kingdom that Daniel sees in his vision. It is also clear that the stone that is cut from the mountain, is done so without hands, i.e. supernaturally. It is not mans effort that will accomplish this but God’s sovereign power through the One who throughout scripture is described as the Rock/Stone – Jesus Christ our Rock! (See 1 Cor 10:4 / Deut 32:4 / 2 Sam 22:2 / Ps 18:31 / Is 51:1 / Matt 16:18 / Acts 4:11 / Matt 21:42-44 / 1 Peter 2:8)
All of this is in agreement with the countless passages that talk of a time of political rule on the earth by the Lord himself. For example, Isaiah writes: “And it shall come to pass in the last days, that the mountain of the LORD'S house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it. And many people shall go and say, Come ye, and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD, to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the LORD from Jerusalem. And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people: and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more.” (Isaiah 2:1-4)
“And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS. He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David: And he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end.” (Luke 1:31-33)
49 Then Daniel requested of the king, and he set Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego, over the affairs of the province of Babylon: but Daniel sat in the gate of the king.
So Daniel is promoted and ensures that his friends are too. As a result of these four Jewish young men the wise men of Babylon were spared from being cut in pieces and their houses being made a dunghill, were they grateful? Sadly the answer is no. In fact as we move into chapter three we will find these wise men conspiring against Hananiah, Mishael and Azariah and trying to get them killed. Their principle motivation was no doubt jealousy, after all they represented the greatest minds in the kingdom but had been made to look foolish by four teenage Hebrew slaves. However, before we are too hard on the Chaldeans and their associates, we should remember that in like manor we rejected the one who had given up His home to come to a foreign land to save us. He crossed a gulf that no one among the sons of men could cross; only one whose dwelling is ‘with the gods’ would be able, and so He humbled Himself and became a man, and then purposed in his heart to do the will of His Father in Heaven, to the extent that He became obedient to the death of the cross, that you and I may go free. He is the Rock that was smitten the first time (Ex 17:6), but will come again to establish His kingdom, a kingdom that will fill the whole earth, a kingdom that will be an eternal kingdom. The kingdom, the power & the glory be His, now & forever, Amen.
May you be blessed and encouraged by this study.
Barry Forder
Adrian Hudson
Barry Forder